cliff by a 2 to 1 margin. so i would say that right now, and i think even republicans would stipulate this, wolf. the president has the leverage here, i mean, republicans also know that if they were to go over the cliff that the tax cuts on the wealthy would increase. you could come back and undue the tax cuts on the middle class expiring. but the president's in a pretty good bargaining position here, which is why you see him sort of hold firm. >> what leverage do the republicans have? >> well, look, i think it -- they understand that for some liberals going over the cliff is okay, because liberals say, you know what, we get those defense cuts we wouldn't get otherwise, and they believe the public would not like to see that, and i think at some point, wolf, you have to say, i don't know when it is, but at some point the president and his people as dana bash was just talking about, need to get to the negotiating table. let's be fair to the house speaker. he put a plan on the table that included revenues, substa